Sunday, February 22, 2009

Are Black Women ready to join hands?

I have been thinking about the relationship black women have with each other a lot lately and how it impacts our working together to pull ourselves out from a deep hole. I was a naive one to believe that black women were and are invested in having open and honest discussions with each other about our current crisis as black women and I am talking particularly about the 'intellectuals' and well versed among us. I thought that at least I could count on black women being upfront with each other and not hiding critical knowledge. I used to think that those who prided themselves as being intellectuals would be too conflicted internally at the idea of employing intellectual dishonesty in conversation with fellow sisters and would not put forward arguments they didnt believe deep down.

I used to think that the vigorous defences many of these black women mount on behalf of black men are real and because they are convinced. I have discovered however that many are doing so without conviction and with huge doubts about the men they are defending and asking fellow black women to go on trusting and holding out for. Some argue this way knowing of more evidence to suggest an even more dire situation than is presently understood, and many are indeed sitting on information and analysis and insight that could be useful in 'liberating' their fellow black women!

The level of dishonesty was illuminated for me when a woman I knew to be a proponent of 'black unity' and equally a vigorous black male defender, was having a crisis of faith. She talked about how she had always stuck up for black men and she was now seeing that rather than return the favour, they were so deeply selfish and self serving. She more or less admitted that she did what she thought she needed to do for brothers. I shook my head because it had all been a 'routine' for her. In her zeal to serve black men she had lost sight of the critical fact that many black women would have been lulled into complacency by her actions.

But then I guess this undescores how that black women get their 'sisterhood' from the relationship they have with black men quite unlike white women who define 'sisterhood' through their relationship with other women.

Her whole dilemma by the way, reminds me of that Mary J Blige song 'Not Gon Cry' where she sings, 'All the time that I was loving you, you were busy loving yourself'. Its a real deep song that spells out perfectly the one way relationship black women have been having with black men.

Anyway I was taken aback at this revelation because I always believed her to be speaking from a place of conviction when defending black men. I guess I was in a way projecting on her, the ethics that I abide by, and the fact that I alway bother to give a damn and to be genuine with fellow black woman. I never present an argument that I dont believe in or one that I have deep doubts about. That to me is deceitful. But I am learning, that for many black women 'playing dutiful black woman' and 'defending black men', takes precedence over all sorts of critical things and even the truth and what they know to be right and comonsense.

One key reason why many black women are in utter confusion at this point; not knowing what to believe and what to do, is because they have made a practice of overriding internal honesty particu;arly in service of black men. Not just that, this black woman thought that this 'dishonest defence' was appropraite among her fellow women; not white people or outsiders but among black women who she should have been able to drop the mask with (once again underscoring that many black women have more loyalty towards men than women).

And then she realised that this was not a fair deal.

It reminds me of plea bargins people accept when they see they have been duped. Before then, most refuse to be moral and honest or consider the victims and those who have suffered as a result of the actions of the persons they are trying to protect!

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Khadija said...

Hello there, Halima!

You said, "Not just that, this black woman thought that this 'dishonest defence' was appropraite among her fellow women; not white people or outsiders but among black women who she should have been able to drop the mask with (once again underscoring that many black women have more loyalty towards men than women)."

What I'm beginning to accept is that many BW don't have ANY loyalty or true, positive bonds to other BW. In many ways it's similar to life under segregation: Black folks didn't have any affirmative, positive ties to each other that were self-selected. We were just thrown together by default.

I now see that many BW just find themselves "thrown together" socially with other BW by default. The only positive, affirmative ties that many BW are actively seeking out are with BM. Period.

I discovered this when I was shocked to read many women say up front that they didn't want to reach out to other BW (during a blog discussion). They said they didn't want to seek out friendship or true fellowship with other BW.

I was appalled and amazed by this. But these statements opened my eyes to how a lot of us actually think.

Peace, blessings and solidarity.

foreverloyal said...

Are Black Women ready to join hands?
--Overall? I'd say not. Depressing, but true. However, I believe there are a few that are. All we can do is seek these women out, vet them of course, and then proceed from there.
Hopefully as time goes on, others will awaken.

Anonymous said...

"I discovered this when I was shocked to read many women say up front that they didn't want to reach out to other BW (during a blog discussion). They said they didn't want to seek out friendship or true fellowship with other BW."

I hope this changes.

Lena said...

I don't support black men at the expense of black women because most of the good black men are taken and the damaged ones are so good at lying and manipulation that they can trick the unwary and veterans alike.

Sorry I don't believe in loyalty to black men at the expense of my well being and I feel sad that there are some black women who have thoroughly convinced themselves that black men are above reproach.

These women are having their loyalty to black men being repaid with contempt and scorn. When are they gonna realize like JLo in the movie "Enough" that there is only so much you can give before you have nothing.

jess said...

I feel your frustration. I cant for the life of me understand why bw are stuck on stupid when it comes to what we need to do to make our lives better. forget about what bm and the bc needs.

Anonymous said...

It is NOT EASY separating ones self from the bc when you live and work there. If most of those people find out that you are dating other race men, you some how become the talk of the work place and there must be something wrong with you...unless you are a bm. Unfortunately, many of us bw are living from pay check to pay check and it is not going to be easy moving and especially from Mom and Dad.

Recently, I told a bw friend of mines that my son had bought me a big stuff Guerrilla for Valentines' Day. My friend lol really hard and said that was my son's way of saying you should be with a bm. I was surprised by what she had said because she knows my feeling about irr. Now this was coming from a woman who was way too happy about getting rid of her bm husband. However, she did say that if a good other race man came along she would not be against the relationship.

Hmmm, people are so funny.

Hermster said...

Very informative website Lorraine, thank you.

Anonymous said...

I say no because whenever black women get together, they have this kind of mental competition with each other for someone else attention be it another black person or a none black person. I have also noticed the facades in the beginning of the meeting and getting to know each other phase and then the facades fades and the attitude, aggressiveness, and hostility begins (sometimes it is because you do not live your life like they live theirs, other times it is some kind of control mechanism because they think that you are weak and easy to push around). I have never really been able to get along with them and have them as a friends (because with these particular women that I have dealt with, one or both of the attitudes usually surface with in a month after meeting them) which is really sad because I am a black woman too and I feel that we are sharing the same fight but at the same time I deserve to be respected and I am not going to tolerate the disrespect from any one.

I hope this changes and really soon

sanderosa said...

Black women are the least collaborative group you will find in the universe. Black women can’t work together because the whole foundation of their thinking is based on being in morbid denial. They don’t want the best for themselves and they don’t want the best for each other either. The vast majority of bw are self deluded and can not think strategically – so for now, the bm has nothing to worry about – he can continue being the dysfunctional parasite that he is, feeding off of his clueless host, the black woman.

It doesn’t even take much to deceive bw because they, not the black man, but the black woman so wants to believe that the black race is a cohesive unit when in reality the black race is completely bankrupt; it has nothing to give you. As it stands now, the tiny pool of black men consists of mostly TRASH…the bottom feeders – the ones who are nothing but trouble but they have nothing to lose because they know they can prey on desperate bw who are easily brainwashed anyhow. Even in the face of ice cold hard evidence…even with the completely uninterested, disengaged, utterly disconnected look on the black man’s face black women are still stupid enough to stick with them. Stick with what?? How can you stick with a black man when all he wants to do is avoid his race???? How can you stick with the black man when he won’t dare be seen with you holding hands in public – but he will happily bring his sex organs, his paycheck and a wedding ring to a non-black woman…

Those militant mammies are only fooling themselves – they can go ahead drown in their illogical thinking – they ain’t taking me with them - I know crazy and stupid when I see it.….If as a black woman you can’t see the black man’s only mission is to string you along and avoid you at all costs…all the while your hair is turning grey waiting on the black man to ‘wake up’ but actually you are the one who is in a coma…

I don’t know what are black women waiting for…the black man is so desolate and so pathetic, I look at white men and non-black men in a new light…its either get with a non-black man or go lay in a coffin and wait for the next life because the black man, the black race is DONE….

Taylor-Sara said...

Oh my God! Sanderosa you have laid it out!!! I hope you will let me quote a few things you have said on my blog (wont' use your name if you don't want) But that was a fantastic summation girl!
Halima great post-great and great topic....

sanderosa said...

Taylor-Sara, please feel free to use what I said in your blog…the word needs to get out.

Aabaakawad said...

Hello friends,

I know that bw are the most fascinating women on earth. But with all this psychpathology being revealed here, is there a little something we can say to reassure the non-bm lurking here? I know they are here. I can sense them rubbing their chins on the other side of my screen.

Wishing you all progress.

Anonymous said...

Even though many BW don't want real fellowship with BW, many of us still do. Otherwise there wouldn't be bloggers like y'all ladies urging BW to stick together and there wouldn't be posters like aphrodite, lena, me, etc, co-signing this message. The women who don't want to create a friendship with other BW it's their loss. I think many critical thinking BW who seek friendship with BW end up disappointed because we assume that with the exposure of alarming percentages (70% of fatherless children, 70% of single BW) 90% of BW finally woke up.

It's a mistake. Doesn't mean that it's not changing, but we shouldn't assume everyone WANTS to be woken up, or is ready to face reality. Some BW are irrational and in the words of SANDEROSA "in morbid denial".

I've learned to observe people and who they associate with, I do things like "accidentally" bringing up the ir subject to see their reactions. I no longer assume they have common sense and create bonds first only to be disappointed later. It doesn't take long to see who's a magical thinker and who's not. Just listen to them.

I used to be frustrated because I always ASSUMED BW from my generation (in their 20s & 30s, those I hang with most) knew better. Come to found out that this is not always the case. I remember having a conversation on ir with 2 acquaintances that I assumed were critical thinkers because they were educated, independent. I saw them as potential FRIENDS, and assumed they were free in their minds. One was a single 28 yo BW and not single by choice (i'll call her noemi), one was a business owner, married to a bm (i'll call her terri), and her sister was married to a wm. Noemi wasn't against ir for others but she was against it for herself, still believing the "i love my queen, i only use ww, but i love you" serenade from bm, even if her own brother was in a long term relationship with a ww. Terri was openly AGAINST ir and scorned BW in ir (ironically she had dated out many times before marriage), and despite her sister being married to a wm. Terri swore that there were far more BW with WM than BM with WW (???). It's EASY to detect CRAZY PEOPLE, just listen to them. Terri is now divorced, she had kept my number and called me for help, which I did give because her husband did her dirty. After helping her I still cut ties with her. Bottomline, don't trust people based on assumptions.

I created friendships with sisters who care for BW's well being first. Most BW I hang with are in ir, all of them support it. I thank God for this, I am positive that real friendship among BW is possible. But we have to "study" people before trusting them and/or thinking that 90% of us "woke up".

Anonymous said...

Well what do people expect? Black women have been getting kicked around for CENTURIES, and by who should love and protect her them most, and now you are suprised that there are issues amongst Black women for uniting? It is not a surprise at all!

In any event, I want us to unify, because we only have each other for the most part. I think we as Black women need to be taught how to love ourselves from when we are little girls, since we were taught to hate ourselves from when we were little girls. It is going to take time for us to overcome all the garbage that has been done to us.

CarmellesFabulosity said...

Wow! This was a very interesting post as well as reading the comments.

In my own personal experiences outside of high school there was never time I thought the sisterhood of black women was damned to hell.

Now did I not like a Black woman here and there- HELL YA there was a black chic i didn't like. lol
Black women of all ages have always been there when no one else cared- and especially being in Corporate America.

I am forever thankful for the Black Sisters in my life and their collaborative,unifying, and strengthening presence they share with me and I wish others experience what I have with other Black women