Unedited
No suprises here, but I was recently on an online black forum where they were holding a heated discussion on BlackMen magazine's voting of a Latina Woman as the ‘Sexist Woman of the Year’ (Dec 2006 see image).
Now this site is a very afrocentric one. You know, the ones that in respect to interracial habits of black men, insist on maintaining a deep denial of the severity of the problem, possibly because they want to continue to refuse black women the option of looking out themselves. From what I saw there, the women on that site do indeed abide by the stipulation that, ‘under no circumstances do you consider white men as a valid option’. I must say my visit was a fascinating insight into how black women who still insist on not broadening out because of ‘political commitment’, explain away or handle such issues of black male betrayal (I guess for them it is indeed a case of another day another slap in the face). It was also an insight into how these women (especially the single ones), grapple with the idea that because of the widespread ‘faithlessness’ of bm, they might just not find themselves a mate. I indeed wanted to see if these women employed the technique of ‘waiting infinitum’ which characterised denial (group A), or acknowledging the reality and managing to come to grips with it in their own way (group B).
I think at first there was almost utter disbelief among the women (possibly group A women), and then some of these women did the calculation and realise that this was just consistent with the trends that were evident in general society (group B). However I think bw in denial can still allow themselves a few moments of ‘lucidity’ and let shafts of light penetrate from time to time, or they are not in denial at all, they just accept/normalise the betrayal of bm, and see it as part of the black woman’s cross to bear (true group B women). As an aside I think that bw who are impatient with their sisters who want to broaden out as a result of the dating squeeze, feel that as bw we ought to understand and sign up to this burden and ‘cope’ but still maintain the principle of ‘no outdating’. These women would give a tacit nod to single motherhood as one option left to black women and one much better than dating white.
Well the bm on the site (men who profess extreme afrocentricity), recognised a need to give some sort of response. Their tactic was first to ‘down play’ the issue; to urge bw to ‘deny the evidence of their eyes’. Women were urged not to ‘blow this out of proportion’. An appeal to ‘deny evidence’ is the kind of mind game and twisting techniques that are now required to calm and ‘re-convince’ black women to keep the faith, in these times that black women who want to remain ‘true to black’ are experiencing extreme buffeting.
Some men then proceeded to give all sorts of obvious 'scrapping the barrel' defence as to why the outcome was a Latina winner. One said that maybe ‘three bm huddled in room somewhere’ decided the results, another suggested that white and Latino men constitute a huge number of the readership and thus bumped up the numbers voting for the Latina woman. These two suggestions were quickly despatched with, with the recognition that previous winners had been black and that the readership is widely recognised as black men (should there even be any doubt that a magazine named BLACKMEN would have an overwhelmingly black readership).
The next tactic was a tenuous link of the winner to black. Some men put forth the defence that the winner had, ‘some black genes’ and therefore was a valid choice for a black male magazine (I have seen this argument used before with Jennifer Lopez). The women quickly saw through this as black men defending their white ‘fetish’ by claiming the women for black.
When there was clearly no defence some men changed tactic, some attacked black women in what I feel was their sheer frustration in their fellow black men (displacement), and others as usual decided to put the blame on black women for turning bm into what they had become. The usual, ‘blame black mothers for what their sons turn into’ was then employed. I might add that men who just owned up and said that bm were a lost bunch, got calmer response from bw, who I think know the score deep down, and would like an acknowledgement rather have bm trying to offer defence where there is none. However I think as usual the final, logical step of finally acknowledging that bw have a right to choose to escape the consequences of black males ‘unfaithfulness’ on the dating scene was skirted again.
When there was no more defence left to put forward, someone suggested a ‘campaign’ against the magazine, of writing letters in to express disgust. Apparently this person was loosing sight of the fact that the magazine did not decided the winner and ultimately they have a duty to publish the results as decided on by their readership. Also the underlying and unpalatable implied meaning that BM needed to be forced or arm-twisted into preferring bw seemed to have been missed.
TO BE CONTINUED
26 comments:
Do you have a link to the website?
It is time, we Black women got some skills to combat this extreme form of abandonment and self-hate, yes, self-hate. If anyone knows anything we all know that if a Black man dates other than a Black women, he has done it over and over and over again, practically refusing to acknowledge that Black women even exist.
I'm truly disappointed that Black men minds have been so diverted from reality, that they don't even know that the Black women hatred they have will one day affect their own daughters, even if she is light-skinned with mixed hair, which at one time was a plus for Black women, but now, why have light, bright and almost White, when you can have totally NON-Black.
Yes, I'm the author of Black Women Need Love, Too! There is some seriously useful information in that manual that will put our men in check or we are confidently moving on to the next, period!
Enough is Enough!
I feel the identitiy of the winner is blurry in my mind.
At the end of the day Vida is a softcore model and her winning only highlights the extent of which Black men can object a womans behind. The winner could easily have been someone Black such as "Buffie the Body" and have exactly the same poignance except Black women probably would have kept shut despite such a trashy imo person winning. Vida after all is not that brill looking facially.
When Black men were obsessed with JLo it wasnt exactly her face they were in love with! Black women on some of these site constantly pull out the "booty" stereotypes when in arguments with non Blacks. Its like a safety Blanket. However it is apparent when studying Black hip hop subcultures there is a tendenciy to seperate the female from the "big ass". On the videos you see 100s of women with their backs turned most of the time, non of them identified. When we get in that situation where a particular part of our body only is objectified (opposite to:mixed girls are pretty,hot,interesting) we are in a vunerable position in terms of Black male attraction.
Simply put the booty stands by itself and colors, ethnicites can be interchangeable as the rainbow as far as body part obsessed males are concerened. Contrary to pop belief theres some other non Black females with "fatties" (ha!) and theyll get lapped up like the rest of 'um.
I remember being highly amused at an article in the Guardian magazine which spanned five pages investigating the new bottom obsession and the fact that top psychologists are trying to figure out why Black males like them so much more than anything else.
OFF TOPIC ALERT!!!
I am very befuddled and confused at the moment. Against my better judgement perhaps I have posted a bit on AOL Voices Ebony and Ivory section.
Theres a few guys on there that create ridiculous threads about Black women and a few Black women vice versa. Anyhows my thread was hijacked by a "woman" who I suspect may be a man or a White woman scorned who was pursuing Black women on other threads and being racist and talking crap. Saying all Black women are over weight, ugly, White powerful men dont want us etc...
Anyways she hijacked my thread talking about how Black women are least lifely to put pictures on there profile. I was sticking up for another woman and she ended up challenging me to put my photo up. I told her to ask nicely and ended up putting an old one up.
Anyways this woman said I was a beautiful woman, much better than Alicia Keys then went on to berate some other BW! I am totally confused now because I thought this was just a man pretending to be a White woman(???) What the hell.
I know of where you speak. Some lady on another site just recently told me about it and what a great community it was, i had to think what was she smoking. I had to leave in disgust after reading a few of the threads
The new thing is for them to say advertising encourages black women to get with white men. Black women are rarely in movies now and when they are usually alone or in some drama. It is still way more acceptable to show a black man with a nonblack woman than even show a black woman with a man, any man.
Black people are in such denial. Worldwide trend is for black men to marry out excessively compared to others. even in countries full of black women black men will fight to marry out or for the lightest.
Black men consistently keep black women lowest on their list and block them from other men.
Interestingly enough, many of the black men claiming that they need multiple wives and black women should be cowives, lose the cowive theme and polygamy when they get nonblack women, which lets you know how they really feel.
Oh and black people are good for promoting others over black women. Check the rape and assault numbers on black women, even those living in black neighborhoods. Nonblack women are way more safe around blacks than black women; and black men wonder why so many black women have a block against them. Black people as a culture take great pride in keeping black women in check whether through battering their self esteem or battering their body.
What is your take on the number of black female with white male movies coming out of hollywood? It is becoming a niche to depict a black woman as having this wonderful romance with a white boy. .....I was so discusted by just the title of the film "something new" . So the black man is old, and useless? is that the message?
No one really sits down to consider that 42.4% of the black women who aren’t married- shouldn't get married in the first place or don't want to. They also never consider how such a statistic can remain true since the stream of birth and death are constant, there is no telling what kind of Black Women will arrive or leave.
We all know about the disparities between Black Men and Black Women. ... All animals migrate to where the land is plentiful, why aren't Humans doing the same?
But for all the Women who are looking for these commitments are they employing their freedom to seek? ...
While we might hear about Brothas going to Brazil for sexual fun, or Terri McMillan flying all the way to Jamaica to find a gay younger Man, when she could've found one right on her block- there is really no sincere data suggesting our Black beautiful mates are all over the world, and the love you are looking for doesn't have to be in your Metropolis.
The Metropolis itself is giving birth to very strange bed fellows indeed. .... Ok well let's get all the Women to be together romantically. Black Men in prison- single Black Women running around, Ok- let's find Men from other races to be with them. All so the machine of the Metropolis can keep running and doesn't skip a beat.
Interracial movies featuring Black Women with White Men are trying to give an answer to a daunting question in the minds of most Black Women in America, since there is not enough Men to go around who will love me? Who will produce with me? Hey- why not that nice White guy who give me the eye on the store the other day. Why not Tom from the Mailroom, or Bob from Corporate.
I have news for some of the Ladies, White Men don’t want you because of what you are, they want you because of what they can “have” – they can have other Black Men look at them with disgust to feed thier White egos- they have some black vagina- a piece of Africa itself, and they can have Black babies. What a nice package.
As if black men don't use black women like toilet tissue as well.
All from that site,
and these men claim to care. all this despite the fact that worldwide black women whether through choice or lack of options is more likely to mate with a black man than the other way around.
That topic is what threw men from there. The utter denial and contrived rhetoric to support their ideas when they know black men throw a fit if a male idol is lighter than a paper bag.
Sadly, it's looking more bleak for the girls coming up who are facing all sorts of trauma for being black both from their community and from others outside it and are inculcated from birth with the task of saving, raising, and sacrificing all for the black man and to get a black man.
Tickled Pink,
in music videos the bodies of browner and darker women are shown headless in explicit pose and otherwise as sexual pieces. the lights, brights, whites, and exotic get face time. this has been going on for years now.
thus imparting another subliminal message of the higher value of one and the value of the other as pieces for use and not even full people
thus imparting another subliminal message of the higher value of one and the value of the other as pieces for use and not even full people
I have noticed this too, the sad thing is i see many young Black girls in the area I grew up in wearing fashions that exaggerates their behinds over anything else. I feel some are taught to use it as a trading tool. But accentuating one sexual part of your body and not having confidence in other areas leads to Black young men to just seperate the ass from the female.
When A Black woman is included in a video they seem to have to include a booty shot to justify why they picked that particular girl.
Anyone who doesnt see the dominant culture is BLIND. Plus being the age that I am I can tell you attitudes are due to get worse with this next generation, most Black and mixed girls from my school year have had children with guys who dont give a hell about them and call them "babymother", cheating is allowed now in Black youth communities. Even when aware of cheating they will still accept sex without protection! No matter how much men take the piss some BF subcultures will shift morals and principles to accomodate.
Nobody even blinks twice anymore
the cheating thing is nothing new. monogamous black men were always teh exception, talking to older people, it seemed like the only difference is that people were more discreet.
cheating, violence, rape, and abuse of black women have always been allowed, the information age just allows it to be broadcast anywhere, anytime, to anybody.
black women won't and aren't trained to defend themself and black men make too much money and get too many benefits to stop it.
unlike other men who will exploit their women but block others from doing the same, black men have no problem serving black women up if they benefit.
everyone knows there is no protection for black women and girls. unless black women start getting a backbone and ignore black men's feelings or thoughts on these subjects, most won't be able to survive and have a decent life.
As I wrote before, Halima, on an earlier blog entry a while back, black men are now exploring their options that reach far beyond the variety of shades black women offer. The preference is now exotic, non-black, yet still technically non-white women. I think this is a great middle ground for black men to use to their advantage. They can get their exotic non-black mix without being accused of wanting a white woman. The Blame It On Rio piece that ran in Essence had me thinking: What if the roles were reversed? What if a black male magazine had an article of black women going to some foreign country say for instance, Tahiti, and were bedding down the Tahitian men there because they have a sexual appetite for them and that these men treat black women like 'women', unlike black men, who don't know how to act like men. All hell would have broken loose and black men would have declared an insurrection is taking place that threatens the destruction of our communities! It frightens me how black women are supposed to put with all sorts of nonsense and as you said, believe the denial game being played on them, or even worse, how all of it is our fault. No one is totally blameless or all at fault. The message is if we could just be prettier, have more feminine appeal, stop being so mannish, stop being so smart, stop making more money than your mate, etc., then MAYBE you could have a black man who will stick around.
I do think (just by proof of blogs like this) black women are starting to wake up from their slumber of self-destruction. It is time to stop living through black men (or any man) and start living for us. Start taking a proactive stance in our own well being and happiness. I wish black women would stop begging black men to take a look at them. Stop getting angry with white women and other non-black women. They're not putting a gun to black men's heads. Black men are all too willing to pursue these women; they hardly need any temptation from the other side.
this is crazy. the magazine isn't called BlackWoman magazine. Just cuz its a blackmens magazine doesn't mean that the most popular women in it have to be black. its pretty much known black men aren't discriminating when it comes to booty. who cares about being the winner of a lame magazine with a bunch of fake females. u really want a black women to be the winner of a booty magazine. this doesn't seem like a step foward. Men love black women as well, the problem is there aren't all latino magazines which everyone reads. every man might read blackmen magazine because it there for a whole culture of people, a hip hop culture, etc. the nationality of the female doesn't matter this doesn't mean black men like black women any less. and it certainly has nothing to do with anyones momma.men like what they see, this year they liked a latina chick. i dont think its that deep. the problem is women being exposed like this in the first place. exploitation of latina and black women.
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Hello Everyone,
This is my first time posting on this site, but I have read some articles here that I enjoyed. The one that stood out to me was the one about pro-black men marrying white women and you had a whole slew of pictures Halima. I am glad someone pointed it out b/c I thought I was the only one who saw that hypocrisy. You also had Abdoulaye of Senegal there with his white wife and first lady of a black country. ONLY black men that value other women above their own.
Do you think a nonblack magazine will choose a black woman as sexiest? HELL NO. In the rare case that happens, it would be a very mixed looking, very light black woman who resembles one of their nonblack woman. I have been involved with 2 guys who BOTH mentioned to me they prefer light skinned women. So that made me wonder why the hell they are with me. I didn't last very long with the first one due to his arrogance and other things. The 2nd one I fell in love with. I still love him and hate myself for still being so in love with him. No surprise, his current love interest and girlfriend is a very light Ethiopian girl. My ex and I are both West Africans. This phenomenon of black men prefer light skinned women exists with ALL black men over the world even black arabs. If a black man is wealthy and successful you can almost guarantee his wife is light or not even black.
My 2nd ex and I broke up over the fact that I preferred to wait until marriage to have sex. He tried to make me feel guilty and that I didn't love him etc... After he told me light skinned women are his preference and that he was never involved with a dark girl before me, I was more cautious and less relucatant to give in to him. I thought maybe he is just trying to use me for sex and after being together for over 6 months, he realized I wasn't ready to give in to him. I am so glad I didn't despite my love for him b/c I would have so regretted letting him take my virginity. I think he will settle down with his first choice (a light skinned woman) at the end of the day. I think I was more serious about him than he was about me. I just hate the fact that I still love him and think about him quite a bit.
I haven't been involved with a nonblack man but I am open to it. I don't want to make it a revenge thing or tit for tat game with black men. Love and happiness doesn't work that way. I will date a nonblack man if I genuinely feel we are compatible and he is genuine and not looking to "try" a black woman. Sometimes I don't even care for marriage. I just want children b/c I love kids. However, I do prefer to have children with my future husband. it's just I think I tend to be cynical about marriage lol...I hate to see so many single black sisters while black men are choosing other women and building families with them. Men of other races don't abandon their women and children. If black men don't stop this self-hate and have pride in their heritage, uplift and respect their women, they will always be at the bottom of the barrel as they have always been. let's face it, white men have the power and all other men are
still far above black men in terms of power and success. Once a black man reaches a position of wealth and power, he choose to share it with a nonblack woman and transfer his wealth to her. He also dilutes his genes with his mixed children. Black men don't care about having a black family, which is our foundation and strengthen. White men have weakend their minds and made them believe that their women (white women) and anything) close to them are better than their beautiful black women. Black men don't value black women and it's a major reason why they are the least successful men in the world. Don't worry sisters, when they reject us they are rejecting themselves. They are hurting not only us, but themselves. I would advise sisters to just look for their PERSONAL happiness when looking for a partner. That's what black men go for. They don't care about building strong black communities which starts from a black FAMILY with a black man AND woman. When I look at black men, it's no wonder as black people we are bottom of the barrel. If a society is weak, look at the men. If they valued the black women who give birth to them and their children and nurture them, you would see a lot of improvements among blacks worldwide.
Look at the Indians and Lebanese in Africa. They are very successfl and make sure to keep their success among their people so it can grow among them. How do they do that? By marrying their own and giving the wealthy to their OWN women and children. If they didn't they would become so mixed in the larger black african populations they live in and lose their identity. Black men feel nonblack women are more deserving of their money and to have their children. They prefer women who will give them children that look nothing like them.
Anyway sorry for the long post. This topic touches close to home for me. Like I said sisters, go for PERSONAl happiness. Whether the man is black or not, go for the responsible man that you love and who also loves you and treats you with kindness and respect. Don't feel guilty about dating a white guy or marrying one and having mixed kids. Black men don't give a damn. They go for their PERSONAl happiness and they last thing they give a damn about is having a black family or the success of black communities. They will ignore all the black beauties around the world and invest their life and money on a nonblack women. Light skinned black women have it a little easier due to their complexion. This gives them and advantage in attracting black men. Well at least with a light black woman he is still withing the community and having black children.
Anyway sisters, go for a good man. I will marry any good man, but I am usually not physically attracted to Asian mn for some reason though I have found a few attractive. I try to have a positive outlook on marriage and romance. I do not dislike ALL black men, but I am just aware of the many (sadly many) who don't value women who resemble them. It hurts when the man you love so much says, your type of beauty is not enough for him. I really want to get over my ex. I went to a friend's event last week and I saw him and his new girlfriend there. She is such a b****. She tries to do things to rub it in my face. She comes with this attitude like "I got your man." However, I was strong and just danced with my friends like nothing happened. She would be sitting in his lap and doing things she know will hurt me to see. The best way I figured to deal with her was to ignore her. Also what helped was that my friends were supported and commended me for the way I dealt with her. I am cordial with both him and her. I never show any jealousy and she hates it. I won't let her get a rise out of me. It's hard to see him with her, but I'll never let them know how I feel. I need to keep my pride. it's over as he seems to be so in love with her so no need embarassing myself over a guy who doesn't want me and is in love with another woman
Okay, phew. That was a long rant. Sorry for the long post. Your article just reminded me of so many things. i just had to get my feelings out. I am struggling with getting over my ex and being reject for my color by a guy who is the same color. I was so good to him so it hurts. The breakup was so sudden and came as a shock. I even got along well with his fam. I still communicate with his mother (she doesn't like his new girlfriend either as she is arrogant). But you know HE has to love me for us to be together not his mother as I won't be marrying her.
Anyway, that's enough about me. Good night ladies. i hope you all find good loving men who love and value you. If anyone has any tips on getting over a man it would be greatly appreciated.
Sorry for the typos, I didn't take the time to proofread my long post.
The poster who made the comment about polygamy is so right. They expect black women to put up with the pain of sharing a man. We are just sex toys and baby machines for many black men.
Like you said, they love to marry out, but block us from other men. They hate to see us with other men especially if you are a very attractive black women. However, they will still choose a nonblack woman over you. A black man could be with a white girl and get upset about a black woman with a nonblack guy. However, i would say all men are territorial like that. They will date other women, but hate to see other men have their women. Arabs are very much like that too.
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